Extradited cleric takes editor to court for defamation

28 Aug, '07

You probably remember Mr. Wagdy Ghoneim, the guy that was thrown out of the States and is now still waiting for being blessed with a Bahraini passport (shock horror!) even though his immensely popular religious show on our Bahrain TV canned; hence, the country no longer requires his services, but he’s not only still around, he has taken Isa Al-Shaiji, the editor-in-chief of Al-Ayam newspaper and the head of the Bahrain Journalists Association to court for defamation!

Needless to say, Wagdy doesn’t have a leg to stand on, but is probably looking for another financial compensation package to help defray the high costs of living in this overly generous country.

We’re all with you Isa and are sure that you will win, even though you are dragged once again in front of the Public Prosecutor for just expressing an opinion, treated like a common criminal just for your and your paper’s word. But persevere my friend, it’s all for a good cause.

As to Wagdy, I think he should take the opportunity given by the Ministry of Labour and apply for free plane tickets back to wherever he came from before the illegal migrant amnesty period ends.

And that, my friends, would be good riddance and none too soon!

Update 29 Aug, ’07: BJA Press Release after the break (in Arabic)

استمع وكيل النيابه محمد العامر صباح اليوم الاربعاء الي اقوال رئيس تحرير صحيفة الأيام رئيس جمعية الصحفيين البحرينية عيسى الشايجي ، بخصوص الدعوى التي رفعها أحد رموز جماعة الإخوان المسلمين وجدي غنيم عليه بتهمة القذف والدعوى التي رفعها ضده وضد الكاتب احمد البغدادي القاضي الشرعي وخطيب الجمعه عبدالرحمن الفاضل بتهمة الاساءة الي المسلمين ؛ وذلك بحضور ممثل جمعية الصحفيين ونائب رئيس الجمعية عادل المرزوق والمحامية فاطمة الحواج .
وقد قررت النيابة العامة الافراج عن رئيس تحرير صحيفة الايام ورئيس جمعية الصحفيين البحرينية بضمان محل الاقامه .

وأعرب الشايجي عن شكره لجهود المحامية فاطمة الحواج وقال الشايجي يشرفني ان تكون محاميتي امرأة في القضية .. المرأة التي يقف وجدي غنيم ومن على شاكلته ضدها ويدعون الى عدم تمكينها بما يتنافى مع مشروعنا الوطني الديمقراطي وجهود المجلس الأعلى للمرأة .
وقال نحن نعتز بالمرأة البحرينية التي وقفت جنبا الي جنب مع الرجل في مسيرة تنمية البحرين ؛ بل وتحملت اعباء اضافية ؛ فكيف نسمح لغنيم ان يقتحم مدارسنا اليوم وينشر افكاره البالية بين الطالبات ويحاول ان يميز فيما بينهن ويفرق بين الاخت واختها وبين المسلمة والمسيحية في بلد رسخ مفاهيم التعايش بين مختلف الطوائف والمذاهب .

وقال ان موقفنا قوي وسليم صحفياً وقانونياً فالمدعو وجدي غنيم جاء الى البحرين بعد ان لفظته أمريكا وعدد من الدول واخذ يتدخل في شؤوننا الداخلية بكل صلافة وينشر أفكاره في المجالس والندوات والمنابر الدينية والتلفزيون والمدارس وكل هذه الامور موثقة وبشهادة شهود .

وأضاف الشايجي ان أفكار وممارسات وجدي غنيم تشكل خطراً على الشباب والناشئة وتضر باستقرار البحرين وسلامتها وتخرب علاقتها مع الدول الشقيقة والصديقة حتى اضطر الانتربول ان يتدخل في إحدى القضايا التي ستكشفها صحيفة الأيام قريباً .

وتساءل الشايجي : من سهل لوجدي غنيم الدخول الى البحرين وهو الممنوع من دخول عدد من الدول الغربية والعربية ؟! ومن مكنه من المنابر الدينية لينشر أفكاره ؟! ومن مكنه من تلفزيون البحرين ؟! وكيف يسمح لنفسه بأن يتدخل في شئوننا الداخلية ؟! وكيف دخل مدارسنا ؟
وقال ان كل هذه الأسئلة مطلوب الإجابة عليها بوضوح .

وأضاف اننا نقدر ونحترم رجال الدين والمشايخ المعتدلين الذين ينشرون الوعي ونشكرهم على ذلك ولكن وجدي غنيم لا ينشر الوعي وانما ينشر أفكار تضر بسمعة البحرين وسلامتها ويمكن ان تكون عواقبها وخيمة .

وأكد ان صحيفة الأيام عندما نشرت عن المدعو وجدي غنيم انما كان دافعها الحرص على مصلحة البحرين وشبابها وهي البلد الذي عرف بالتسامح والاعتدال ؛ مشيرا الي ان صحيفة الايام سوف تكشف قريبا ملف وجدي غنيم كاملا .

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Comments (44)

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  1. bahrainiac says:

    Didn’t they write a song about him??? :mrgreen:
    Wagdy wag, don’t talk back!

  2. ba7ranee looser says:

    i think they should hang u fatty bastard
    and take u to gitmo =)

  3. mahmood says:

    Ah, he’s back. Welcome welcome…

    May I invite you to the Imam Mahdi the redeemer major celebration all over Bahrain tonight? We can start in Duraz and go through the villages all the way to Muharraq. And you know what? You can stand in front of my superduper camcorder and do the live commentary too to show your love and affection to the people of Bahrain and the world.

    Give me a call if you decide to come, I’m sure you know how to contact me.

  4. mahmood says:

    Wagdy wag, don’t talk back!

    says Bahrainiac!

    Saweet!

  5. Bedoon Esam says:

    Mahmood the GENERAL AMNESTY by labour authorities is available to ALL ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS that you are correct.

    But to the best of my knowledge the FREE AIR TICKETS are being offered only by Bahrain FM 104.20 for its INDIAN Listeners in conjunction with Qatar Airways.

    FREE AIR TICKETS are not available to all ILLEGALS.

    MY PLEA please do not advice this creep to claim a FREE AIR TICKET to INDIA, we have enough weirdos their as it is….

  6. mahmood says:

    Bedoon, I’ll happily pay for him to be on his way if he promises never to come back!

  7. alcazar says:

    #

    1bahrainiac | 28 Aug, 2007 at 18:18 | Reply

    Didn’t they write a song about him??? :mrgreen:
    Wagdy wag, don’t talk back!

    LOL!!!!!!!!!! You are the greatest bahraniac!

  8. bahrainiac says:

    I’m just here for your amusement! 😀

  9. afkaynak says:

    Mahmood Den: Intelligent, informative and fun! …. Oh yeah? Or, it’s truly: thick, hatred-ridden and belligerent?

  10. Shaima says:

    what is the story behind this man? sorry for my ignorance…

  11. Mahmood Den: Intelligent, informative and fun! …. Oh yeah? Or, it’s truly: thick, hatred-ridden and belligerent?

    awww… you have stepped on someone’s little foot I see!!

    Let the fireworks begin!!! 👿

  12. SMBS says:

    Oh God !

    I hate such people who speeks like he knows everything and well to do anything 👿

  13. Spitfire says:

    If that is your picture uptop the site, then I understand why would you say what you said. I advise you to sit “bottoms-up”, perhaps we’ll get a better view!!!

  14. Spitfire says:

    People like الشايجي are nothing more than a venting pipe for all the filth of the world, starting from immorality to free sex utopias. Of course in your sick mind you are thinking that I am a crazy maniac. We’ll let’s make something clear, if you or him or your likes call yourselves Muslims, Allah has obligated the Hijab on women, no scholar has ever disputed this fact, no interpretation of the verses and ahadieth has ever negated this fact. Now, do you believe that? Are you and him advocates of Islam? Now, you’re not, so the least you can do is be a man and don’t call yourself a Muslim, or adhere to Islamic rules. You seem to have a lot of love towards western values, so to speak, go live there and enjoy their freedoms, and hopefully one of your daughter will be one of those American teens who would brag about how many boys she did it with and how many positions she had!!!! Either embrace what will make you a decent human, Islam, or join the shit you so much like. DON’T speak about Islam when you are an ignorant fool with no Islamic knowledge … ERAU rings a bell, Mr. Avionics Engineer!!! Again refer to the proper sitting position above!

  15. mahmood says:

    Ah, we have a zeolous defender of Islam here, welcome welcome my friend and do increase our knowledge of Islam why don’t you. And while you’re at it, negate the point of view that the hijab was meant only for the Prophet’s wives in order to distinguish them from the many slave women they had in those days and in order for men (like you most likely) who harass and interfere with them while they go about their business.

    As for me being a man, I am, I stand by what I believe, I stand by Islam and Muslims, and as a Muslim I stand against insects like you who have conveniently hijacked my religion and society from the freedoms and tolerance inherent in our religion and most definitely absent from yours.

    As for being a man, I stand in all transparency by declaring my name and full beliefs and not hide behind a pseudonym which declares nothing more than a fervent wish to appear diametrically opposite to what I am in real life.

    I know that you don’t want to discuss things in order to expand your horizons – limited as they are, they do need expanding – but to just act as a troll inviting hatred and expressions of depravity both of which you excel at. Hence, I shall simply ignore your existence as everyone else in real life has and shall delete any further brainfarts you emit in order not to divert our – the adults – discussions.

    Now scat.

  16. Spitfire007 says:

    If you are a man don’t delete this, or are you afraid that I might expose your true ignorance! I dare you to let my posting stand!

    The aforementioned point of view that the Hijab was mandated on the wives of the prophets ONLY is to say the least abysmal. Allah said in the Quran ( يا أيها النبي قل لأزواجك وبناتك ونساء المؤمنين يدنين عليهن من جلابيبهن ذلك أدنى أن يعرفن فلا يؤذين ) [الأحزاب: 59] If you understand Arabic then you can clearly read the “wives of the believers” in the verse, not just the wives of the prophet.

    Second point, how can the best women, i.e. the wives of the prophet, be obligated to cover up while the rest of the women are not. And why would they be obligated to cover up in the society of the companions who are far more pious than any of us, and then you claim that our women need not to wear the Hijab!

    Your claim that most women were slaves at the time of the prophet is simply false and please provide references! Ok, let’s assume that this is true, so why not distinguish the rest of the free women, and why not “oppress” the slaves by covering them up instead of the free women? Am I working your brain too much toots!

    We’ll the previous was just a dap not to elaborate. Of course since you subscribe to the perverted shiaa sect, you most likely think most companions are hypocrites anyway and the Quran has be abrogated, etc ….

    I don’t need to mention my name, and why do you care? Is it my argument that you hate or is it I? Aren’t you man enough to respond to my “ignorant” claims.

    Be a man and post my brainfarts and respond with you abundant knowledge. You can call me an insect and not wanting to expand my horizon, so please let me expand my horizon, after all you are one man to talk about expanding!!!!

  17. mahmood says:

    Be a man and post my brainfarts

    With pleasure! I normally pay for such amusement! 🙂

  18. Spitfire007 says:

    I appreciate your evenhandedness by letting my posting stand. Thank you!

    I intended to insult you to make you realize two things:

    1. Insult hurts! So keep that in mind when you speak about anyone in the future. Even if you disagree with Sheik Wagdi, you should present him with the proper respect that any human deserves.

    2. For most people, Insult will attract the attention of the addressed but will make him return the insult and hence abolish any dialogue. If you truly believe that Sheik Wagdi is wrong, present your evidence and make your case without personal attacks.

    Anyone can find something about anyone to insult him and hurt him or her by it, but what is the point? Is it to demean the opposition and subdued their character?

    Knowledge is a virtue only known to those who not only have it, but also are humble! I speak to you with evidence and reason, responding with your opinions does not provide for a true and objective discussion, rather an argument. If I were humble enough, I would admit to your case when presented with the proof.

    A delicate point, you might say, so your Sheik tells you that all women need to wear Hijab and you believe him, my Sheik says the opposite, or I read the Quran and that’s not what I understood. Okay, think about this:

    As an avionics engineer, you can talk about maintaining/improving the electronic systems in the aircraft, and you can rightfully do so. However, with no proper education in quantum physics, I think you’ll agree that speaking about nanoparticle plasmon would be absurd.

    Why can’t we all realize the same with religion, the most important science we have?

    Now that doesn’t mean that you can’t research a specific topic in any field for which you are an expert and have a discussion with someone who is very knowledgeable in that field, the key word here is research, i.e. doing your homework!

    I am not here to lecture you, but the smart listens to advice from anyone, even if they are below them.

    I will ask for your forgiveness for what I have said about you, and I hold no grudges. Debate my ideas all you want and allow me the opportunity to respond.

  19. mahmood says:

    There is copious evidence against Wagdi and Soltan that any simple Google search would unearth. I still maintain that their presence in my country does not enrich it in any way, in fact quite the opposite is true, as evidenced by the poison they have brought with them.

    As to insulting to get the attention, that doesn’t move me one bit, go ahead and notch your arrows and let them fly until you tire, they don’t bother me.

    What does; however, is your sectarian attitude which is prevalent in all of your comments, the latest of which is this:

    Of course since you subscribe to the perverted shiaa sect, you most likely think most companions are hypocrites anyway and the Quran has be abrogated, etc ….

    How can you for a second ascribe this to a simple insult to jolt me to attention? This to me and any other person regardless of sect or religion even is an clear invitation of exclusion and all that entails. That not only suggest, but wholly confirms that should you get to know that a truck-bomb was being prepared exclusively to be exploded right within the Muharraq processions for instance or after Friday prays or a maatem meeting that you will not lift a finger to try to stop it, but will actually applaud its explosion surmounted by your fervent shouts of Allah Akbar!

    No, I don’t want to have anything to do with you, nor with your friends and sympathiser.

    You don’t need to apologise to me, you need to apologise to Islam and Muslims as a whole and the Shi’a particularly for your terrorist and exclusionary attitude.

  20. Abu Arron says:

    Why can’t we all realize the same with religion, the most important science we have?

    I’ve got a problem here with this statement. Religion is a science? Sorry, can’t get my head round that one.

  21. Spitfire1 says:

    Let’s go through your elongated and elaborate response one by one:

    Your country! That is not sectarian? Which is it that unites you with others? Is it nationality, religion, color, race, etc? I know your slogan of no shiaa, no shunni, just Bahraini … if your claims were true, why would you put up the profile of the Jamrii who instigated violence in Bahrain and I witnessed it and saw his signed letters to the shiaa especially the events at UOB.

    My comment about the shiaa sect was not to insult you, but to rather present the truth about it. I have debated many shiaa and read many of your references for which I would be more than happy to provide a list. Insulting the companions and calling the prophet’s wife an adulterer is an undeniable part of your believes, unless you have rejected the shiaa believes? Is that a religion or a declaration of hatred and evil? As for you typical speeches quoted from people who speak against Islam, I would not certainly kill innocent civilians regardless of their believes. Unlike your likes! A pure example is the army general who was ambushed and mutilated by 10 shiaa in Bahrain as he was driving back home in a rainy night. How many Shiaa were killed by sunnis in Bahrain? How about the poor Indians and Pakistanis, some of were not even Muslims, who were burned alive in Sitraa by the shiaa. I am not going to attempt to talk about Iraq, as you will just deny.

    Your believes are the violent believes, not me. I only take force when I need to defend my religion and my family.

    I need not to apologize to Islam, as I don’t represent Islam. Islam represents itself. I try to understand it through scholastic means and implement it in my life. You on the other hand can’t even debate your believes!

    I apologized to you because I don’t hate you, I pity you! You on the other hand are full of anger and hatred.

    Where is your scholastic response to the Hijab issue?
    Why did you change your attitude towards the royal family after your detention?
    Why can’t you tolerate Sheik Wagdi’s views, I though you were tolerant?
    What exactly did he say that you call poison? Or is it because he is Sunni?
    What exactly is your stand from religion? Is it a way of life, or is it a personal thing?

    To Abu Arron: Islam is science. Science is limited to our observations, Islam is based on reason and science, but there are parts of it that don’t pertain to the fundamental belief that are beyond our comprehension. That of course doesn’t make it wrong or false. Example, people didn’t comprehend flying in the sky 200 years ago, doesn’t mean that it is not possible. Again, science is based on observation, if you haven’t seen it you don’t know it, not don’t believe it! Very simply put, try explaining red to a blind person, good luck!

  22. mahmood says:

    Spoken like a true believer. But a believer in an exclusionary version he tries to peddle as Islam and Islam couldn’t be farther from his limited grasp of reality.

    <ignore mode on>

  23. Spitfire2 says:

    Such a compelling response!

    أَفَلَمْ يَسِيرُوا فِي الأَرْضِ فَتَكُونَ لَهُمْ قُلُوبٌ يَعْقِلُونَ بِهَا أَوْ آذَانٌ يَسْمَعُونَ بِهَا فَإِنَّهَا لا تَعْمَى الأَبْصَارُ وَلَكِنْ تَعْمَى الْقُلُوبُ الَّتِي فِي الصُّدُورِ

    [الحج:46]

  24. mahmood says:

    Yes I know that you share your intellectual level with well trained parrots. You’ve proven that before.

    But if and when you actually want to enter into a conversation without having to use the aforementioned faculties and without jumping up and down shouting your head off like a maniac, let me know.

    I would like to know what makes you tick.

  25. mdc says:

    “I would like to know what makes you tick.”

    Youth, too much testosterone, and believing the bias he heard around the house every day from his parents!

    On the bright side, one point for Steve’s side.

  26. Hunyadi Janos says:

    Spitfire, I have a question to you. Could you give me the Koran verse numbers that mandate hijab for women, describe hijab, from what age women have to wear it.

    I see in many Middle Eastern pictures that there are a large number of women who do not wear hijab. Will God punish them for that? What is the punishment and is there a Koran verse reference for that as well?

    I read a Koran verse on the Internet, 5.51 that said that if I am a Jew or a Christian, a Muslim is not allowed to be my friend just because of my religion. I am Christian, and just because of my religion a Muslim cannot be my friend? Please give me Koranic verse numbers for reference if I am not correct, but I found verses like that very strange AND unfair.

  27. Spitfire3 says:

    To: Hunyadi Janos

    Thanks for your questions and for your respectful attitude. Your questions are well presented and are very valid questions.
    To answer your first question: the matter of Hijab is discussed in this verses: “And tell the believing women to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts, etc.) and not to show off their adornment except only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils all over Juyubihinna (i.e. their bodies, faces, necks and bosoms, etc.) (An-Nur 24:31)
    It is also mentioned in Surah Al-Ahzab: “O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks (veils) all over their bodies. That will be better, that they should be known (as free respectable women) so as not to be annoyed. And Allâh is Ever Oft¬ forgiving, Most Merciful. (Al-Ahzab 33:59)
    The above verses clearly prove that every Muslim woman is addressed and ordered to observe Hijab. It was not peculiar to the wives of the Prophet. The second verse provides some of the wisdom behind Allah command, but clearly, it does not mean that it is the only reason and the first verse is evidence for that, as the command is not conditioned.
    Koran describes the main ruling, and then the Sunnah (i.e. authentic saying and doing of the prophet) details the ruling. For example, Allah commands Muslims to pray in the Koran, however, the how-to and when and the other details are only found in the Sunnah. Similarly, the fine details of the Hijab are found in the Sunnah, but he main text is still very clear and self-explanatory. In the Sunnah we find ample evidence to the proper form of Hijab, for which I will provide four narrations, unfortunately, I couldn’t find the exact English translation in English, but if you are interested I can translate them to my best knowledge. For now, the jest of this is that it shows that the women covered up from head to toe.

    قوله صلى الله عليه وسلم: المرأة عورة. رواه الترمذي وابن حبان وصححه الألباني.
    في الصحيحين عن عائشة رضي الله عنها أن النساء كن ينصرفن من المسجد بعد صلاة الفجر متلفعات بمروطهن، وفي الصحيحين أيضا عن عائشة في قصة الإفك أنها لما استيقظت فرأت صفوان بن المعطل خمرت وجهها عنه بجلبابها.
    وفي سنن أبي داود عن عائشة أيضا قالت: يرحم الله نساء المهاجرات الأول، لما أنزل الله : [وَلْيَضْرِبْنَ بِخُمُرِهِنَّ عَلَى جُيُوبِهِنَّ] شققن أكثف مروطهن فاختمرن بها. صححه الألباني.

    As for the age, any human is responsible for his/her action starting from the age they reach sexual puberty. Nonetheless, as with anything else, you should have a head start and teach your children these obligations earlier than that.

    Your second question regarding punishment. Allah has said in the Koran: {And We never punish until We have sent a Messenger (to give warning).} [Israa, 17:15]

    Allah has sent prophet Mohammed to deliver the message and hence the knowledge has been established and preserved. Those who disobey Allah can be punished for their sins. Allah said:

    {But those who disobey Allah and His Messenger and transgress His limits will be admitted to a Fire, to abide therein: And they shall have a humiliating punishment.}
    ( An-Nisa, 4:14)

    “Unless I proclaim what I receive from Allah and His Messages: for any that disobey Allah and His Messenger,- for them is Hell: they shall dwell therein for ever.” (Al-Jinn, 72:23)

    The reason I say CAN be punished is that sins are two types: between you and God and between you and other creatures (humans and other living beings). Allah can forgive any sin between you and Him except taking associates with him (i.e. Kufr or Shirk). But he can choose to punish you as well. Allah says:
    {Verily, Allaah forgives not that partners should be set up with him in worship, but He forgives except that to whom He pleases.}[4:48]

    If a person repents in this life, Allah promised to accept their repentance and forgive their sins. On the other hand, sins between you and other humans, regardless of religion, race, etc., can only be forgiven by that person or Allah will execute justice either in this life or the hereafter.

    So, a woman disobeying Allah by not wearing Hijab is exposed to the punishment of Allah.

    Your last question regarding friendship with non-Muslims. The verse you quoted is:

    {O you who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians as Auliya (protectors and helpers), they are but Auliya to one another. And if any amongst you takes them as Auliya, then surely he is one of them. Verily, Allah guides not those people who are the Zalimoon (polytheists and wrongdoers and unjust)}.
    ( Al-Maeda, 5:51)

    In that verse, friendship is no the right translation, the Arabic word is أَوْلِيَاءَ
    This word is more accurately translated as protectors or someone that Muslims as a whole would seek for help. That is to say, rely on Allah and each other not on non-Muslims. Also, this command is directed towards the aggressors from the non believes as explained by the following verses:

    {8. Allah does not forbid you to deal justly and kindly with those who fought not against you on account of religion and did not drive you out of your homes. Verily, Allah loves those who deal with equity.
    9 It is only as regards those who fought against you on account of religion, and have driven you out of your homes, and helped to drive you out, that Allah forbids you to befriend them. And whosoever will befriend them, then such are the Zalimoon (wrong-doers those who disobey Allah)}. (Al-Mumtahina , 60:8-9)

    In fact, Allah commands us with justice even in war as described by the following two verses:

    {190 And fight in the Way of Allah those who fight you, but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allah likes not the transgressors.
    191 And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah is worse than killing. And fight not with them at Al-Masjid-al-Haram (the sanctuary at Makkah), unless they (first) fight you there. But if they attack you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers.
    192 But if they cease, then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.} (Al-Baqara, 190:192)

    I hope I answered some of your questions and feel free to respond with more questions and/or comments.

    Allah knows best.

  28. mahmood says:

    I don’t believe that a religion which is supposed to equate between the sexes comes out with such a thing as “women are an abomination” and if you believe that, then how would you feel about your mother, sister or daughter being labelled as such? I most certainly object to any woman being described in such a derogatory manner.

    Now as to the hijab, and given that Islam is a religion of “science” and logic; why does it penalise the woman for the faults of man?

    I mean, if a man has dirty thoughts about women – no matter how beautiful she is and he gets a hard-on, isn’t it the fault of the man for not lowering his gaze than the woman making excuses for being created as beautiful as she has?

    And don’t give me that tired crap of ‘jewels should be protected and put in safes’, I flush my shit and no one sees that too, does that make my shit precious?

    Get a life for God’s sake and don’t speak for my religion and pretend that you are an unknown cleric whose voice is the voice of God and whose reason is infallible.

  29. mahmood says:

    In that verse, friendship is no the right translation, the Arabic word is أَوْلِيَاءَ
    This word is more accurately translated as protectors or someone that Muslims as a whole would seek for help.

    What the hell are you doing on the Internet then? Isn’t it a technology of those whom you should not befriend and seek help from?

  30. Spitfire3 says:

    Where exactly did Islam describe the woman as an abomination? Reference your statements and don’t make ambiguous statements.

    Islam doesn’t penalize women for fault of man. That is an ignorant statement. Islam commands both men and women to dress modestly, so tight jeans are not permissible for men so are bathing suits, however, as women are created in a different physical state that attracts the attention of MEN, we are not talking about Fags who don’t care, they were commanded to observe more modest dress code. Also, Islam preaches the common sense principle of “an ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure”

    Second, dressing modestly is not a penalty, it is an honor! Let me ask you this, since you have daughters, why don’t you let them walk outside naked, it is freakin hot in Bahrain, what if they want to wear a bikini and walk down the street? Why not allow them to do so? If your answer is, they already do, then there is no point for talking any further.

    Third, so are you claiming that you lower your gaze? I read on another of your blogs that amoora was going to dance topless for you, did you intend to lower your gaze during her performance?

    Fourth, so are you denying the verses from the Koran or are you disputing the meaning? If it is the former, then again no need to argue. If it’s the latter, then who’s interpretation is it and what are the qualifications of the interpreter?

    Fifth, a real example is present in the west, and starting to seep to our part of the world, that shows that uncovered women are looked upon as sexual objects and if you deny this, then again no point to talk. Guys in the west look for girls that are attractive, not smart or good hearted. This is why make-up and fashion is a booming industry. They don’t lower their gaze either, or do they?

    As for your comment about the internet, again, an abysmal remark! First, befriend again! I thought we went over that already! Internet is from Moa’mallat not Ibaadaat. Go look it up; I am tired of explaining things to you.

    Lastly, if you look at your responses, they are mere opinions of yours, which I am sure we all appreciate. You never respond with any references or scholastic means. That shows your ignorance. If I am a parrot and a pretend scholar, it should be easy for you to debunk my absurd arguments.

    Either you want to talk through Islam, which you keep calling “your religion,” or your opinions. As from what I have read so far, I am no the least interested in your demented logic. If you want to debate through Islamic knowledge, let me know.

  31. mahmood says:

    Why do all your comments fall between spam promoting viagra and penal length enhancers? Just check with whichever proxy you’re using as I am getting tired of unspamming your comments, at worst, this delays the immense entertainment you are providing us.

    Now as to your latest issuance; there are far too many conditions in your response which is fine, I understand that you live and breathe exclusion rather than inclusion. I’ll humour you; however, as I am genuinely starting to like you.

    Now, I couldn’t find a literal translation for “‘awra” so I translated it to the closest polite alternative which I thought would be “abomination”; the actual translation would be what exactly? Filth? Unsightly? Dirty? Whatever it is, I guess it is okay for you to call your female relatives that, as it is written and you believe the literal aspects of the text. That’s up to you. As far as I’m concerned I believe it cannot be true taking into consideration that Islam is the religion of equality etc.

    Who’s Amoora and can you dig out her contact details from your address book please? She sounds like fun!

    As to debating, alas, I’m afraid that the opinions I provide are way over your head as all you are interested in is repeating text parrot fashion and exercising your cut-and-paste art rather than offering a studied and thought out personal opinion.

  32. Spitfire4 says:

    Hey Mahmood,

    I am starting to like you too, your ignorance is fascinating, especially since you think you’re the shit! So to speak. …

    You ignorant fool who doesn’t understand Arabic, Allah said in the Quran:
    وَإِذْ قَالَت طَّائِفَةٌ مِّنْهُمْ يَا أَهْلَ يَثْرِبَ لَا مُقَامَ لَكُمْ فَارْجِعُوا وَيَسْتَأْذِنُ فَرِيقٌ مِّنْهُمُ النَّبِيَّ يَقُولُونَ إِنَّ بُيُوتَنَا عَوْرَةٌ وَمَا هِيَ بِعَوْرَةٍ إِن يُرِيدُونَ إِلَّا فِرَارًا
    Behold! A party among them said: “Ye men of Yathrib! ye cannot stand (the attack)! therefore go back!” And a band of them ask for leave of the Prophet, saying, “Truly our houses are bare and exposed,” though they were not exposed they intended nothing but to run away. (33:13)

    Does that mean that homes are filth?

    Seriously, go read a book … 💡

    “As to debating, alas, I’m afraid that the opinions I provide are way over your head as all you are interested in is repeating text parrot fashion and exercising your cut-and-paste art rather than offering a studied and thought out personal opinion.”

    Let’s see, your opinions are over my head, umhhh, maybe, let’s go … I’ll pick a field that you claim you are familiar with, avionics and flying … you must have studied some engineering or do you just know how to fly? Can we talk about the momentum equation? No, what about stokes theory? Still no, basic potential flow? Ahhhh , your ass is grass and your ignorance is terminal!

  33. Spitfire3 says:

    Hey Mahmood,

    trying to block me!!! bad boy!

    I am starting to like you too, your ignorance is fascinating, especially since you think you’re the shit! So to speak. …

    You ignorant fool who doesn’t understand Arabic, Allah said in the Quran:

    وَإِذْ قَالَت طَّائِفَةٌ مِّنْهُمْ يَا أَهْلَ يَثْرِبَ لَا مُقَامَ لَكُمْ فَارْجِعُوا وَيَسْتَأْذِنُ فَرِيقٌ مِّنْهُمُ النَّبِيَّ يَقُولُونَ إِنَّ بُيُوتَنَا عَوْرَةٌ وَمَا هِيَ بِعَوْرَةٍ إِن يُرِيدُونَ إِلَّا فِرَارًا
    Behold! A party among them said: “Ye men of Yathrib! ye cannot stand (the attack)! therefore go back!” And a band of them ask for leave of the Prophet, saying, “Truly our houses are bare and exposed,” though they were not exposed they intended nothing but to run away. (33:13)

    Does that mean that homes are filth?

    Seriously, go read a book ….

    “As to debating, alas, I’m afraid that the opinions I provide are way over your head as all you are interested in is repeating text parrot fashion and exercising your cut-and-paste art rather than offering a studied and thought out personal opinion.”

    Let’s see, your opinions are over my head, umhhh, maybe, let’s go … I’ll pick a field that you claim you are familiar with, avionics and flying … you must have studied some engineering or do you just know how to fly? Can we talk about the momentum equation? No, what about stokes theory? Still no, basic potential flow? Ahhhh , your ass is grass and your ignorance is terminal!

  34. mahmood says:

    Typical! I tell you why your comments are stuffed into the spam rubbish bin, and how to avoid that certain fate and you come back with the brainfart that I was blocking you. Brilliant, now I know that apart from you being a cut-and-paste artist and more recently a Google Ninja, you now prove that you just don’t read. That suggests that you just love listening to your own voice.

    Now get that proxy changed, will ya!

    I’ll pick a field that you claim you are familiar with

    See, Google Ninja! Well done boy. I only carry on this “debate” because I find it hugely entertaining; going beyond this and discussing other things with a ghost is not very conducive. And it won’t prove anything, other than going on yet another tangent. Although these sidelines are somewhat entertaining, young grasshopper, it doesn’t do the original discussion any good.

    As to the tangent you threw into the main discussion which is the hijab and ‘awra, I don’t particularly want to go into this but suffice it to tell you what the dictionary definition is:

    fault, defect, imperfection, shortcoming, flaw, vice

    In colloquial Arabic it is even worse than what the polite dictionary suggests and I am fairly sure you know the meaning.

    Now go waste someone else’s time. Like (الله يعز القارئ) your mother, sister or daughter?

  35. Spitfire(the final blow) says:

    As usual, you never take on my questions. Why is that? Because you are an ignorant being!

    And so much for freedom of speech, but again your hypocritical existence is persistent.

    Let me try to talk to you in a way you may understand:

    Read the following verse:

    وَإِذْ قَالَت طَّائِفَةٌ مِّنْهُمْ يَا أَهْلَ يَثْرِبَ لَا مُقَامَ لَكُمْ فَارْجِعُوا وَيَسْتَأْذِنُ فَرِيقٌ مِّنْهُمُ النَّبِيَّ يَقُولُونَ إِنَّ بُيُوتَنَا عَوْرَةٌ وَمَا هِيَ بِعَوْرَةٍ إِن يُرِيدُونَ إِلَّا فِرَارًا

    What does the word عَوْرَةٌ mean:

    a. filth
    b. defect
    c. imperfection
    d. shortcoming
    e. flaw
    f. vice

    Obviously, you are the monkey who can’t find the banana because google says so. And once more your ignorant exsistance shines again when you say

    “In colloquial Arabic it is even worse”

    Quran came as a miracle linguistically! so colloquial Arabic is for your likes! Maybe that’s why you’re in gardening business now!!! Simple enough!

    Enjoy the rest of you miserable existence and here is a verse for you to contemplate:

    وَجَعَلَ لِلَّهِ أَندَادًا لِّيُضِلَّ عَن سَبِيلِهِ قُلْ تَمَتَّعْ بِكُفْرِكَ قَلِيلًا إِنَّكَ مِنْ أَصْحَابِ النَّارِ

    Your ignorance has been proven and your filth has been exposed, DONE!!!

  36. Hunyadi Janos says:

    Spitfire, thank you very much for your very complete answers to my two questions. I have access to Koran translations to English by Shakir, Yusuf Ali, Asad and Pickthal. Of these, I find the Asad translation the easiest to read, but I like to correlate 3-4 translations and think about possible meanings when I get a specific answer from anyone. Hope you don’t mind.

    Can you give me an email address I could use to correspond with you? I like Mahmood’s blogs, and do not want to create an argument and a fire storm each time I ask a question and you answer. I just want to understand some things about Islam, and you give a very clear explanation. If you can, please use chapter numbers for me, not chapter names in Arabic. I do not speak Arabic. I can search more easily that way with numbers only.

    I would also like to find out what sect of Islam you practice, and what your profession is since you could come up with specific Koranic references so easily.

    I find some of Mahmood’s questions to you interesting, but not being a Muslim, with Mahmood not using Koranic references, I cannot put my finger on the actual Koran translations to understand the point of any reference. Too bad, because such a discussion would be interesting for me.

    And guys, be nice to each other. Insults just make you sound like a shithead or skinhead with a ton of tattoos.

    Best regards,

    Janos

  37. mahmood says:

    Huh? After all that bluster I must say that this is an anticlimax. I naively thought that there is actually some hope for you to see reason and prove that even you – an extremist by any means – could be coerced into exercising some grey matter. Alas that is not to be.

    Ah well. If this is the last we see of you it won’t be too soon, but I am frankly saddened. I shall miss you and your cut-and-paste art but shan’t miss your parrot-like excretions.

  38. jihad says:

    Mahmood, I think it’s a shame of you..I remember you apologised last time when they prosecuted you..weren’t you saying the truth at that time..you defend Isa Al Shaiji!! he’s like others call for free speech but when people critize them they’ll go straight to the King crying…you secular people are strange!!

  39. mahmood says:

    “strange” as in “tails and horns” or “strange” as we expose terror sympathising, other religion hating, women persecuting, hypocritical, death and brimstone preaching, intolerant, homophobic cretins whose only relation to religion is the money they collect from people who are happy to have the wool pulled over their eyes?

  40. jihad says:

    Brother,

    you’re steryotyping and generalizing…while your impression might be true in a lot of instances, thinking that this is applicable in all cases is not fair..I’m not from any Islamic groups, but I call for people like you to start thinking with their minds and not hearts and stop being judgmental with people they don’t like..I thinking talking to such people whome you disagree with is a sensible thing to do…however, seculars usually will disregard such (non-sense) idea in the first place!!

  41. mahmood says:

    Ah let’s see:

    however, seculars usually will disregard such (non-sense) idea in the first place

    of course does not fall into:

    you’re steryotyping and generalizing

    Brilliant!

    Carry on McDuff.

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